Starvation as a Weapon: Gaza’s Genocide and the World’s Complicity
Host Mimi Rosenberg of Building Bridges is joined by Raeed Jarrah of DAWN (Democracy for the Arab World Now) and Ziad Abbas Samrouh of the Middle East Children's Alliance to confront the catastrophic humanitarian crisis in Gaza. Together, they expose how famine, deliberately orchestrated by Israel and supported by the U.S. and other complicit actors, has become a tool of genocide. With firsthand accounts from Gaza, they describe the mass starvation, the targeting of humanitarian aid, the legal implications under international law, and the role of global institutions and grassroots movements in stopping the atrocities. This searing conversation demands accountability, action, and an end to complicity in crimes against humanity.
00:00 Introduction: Framing the Crisis in Gaza
00:43 Death by Starvation: Israel’s Siege and Famine as a War Crime
02:27 DAWN’s Legal Findings and U.S. Complicity
03:45 Aid Interception and Militarized Humanitarian Blockade
05:06 Ziad’s Testimony: Children Starving, Hospitals Collapsing
08:38 Gaza’s Water Crisis and Summer Heat
10:22 The Silent Deaths: Families Facing Collapse Without Food
11:55 Human Rights Groups Finally Declare Genocide
13:41 The Myth of Airdrops vs. Real Humanitarian Corridors
15:06 Trapped Aid and a Generation on the Brink
17:08 Raeed on U.S. Taxpayer Responsibility and Genocide Funding
19:44 Calling for UN Peacekeeping Forces and Global Action
22:10 Why Symbolic Gestures Are No Longer Enough
23:53 The UN General Assembly and Uniting for Peace Precedent
26:14 Political Pathways for Accountability and Protection
27:53 Debunking Media Myths and Israeli Propaganda
30:12 The Role of Western Governments in Perpetuating Genocide
32:31 Israel’s Historical Genocide and Settler-Colonial Aims
34:55 Targeting Palestinians—A Systematic Erasure
36:47 The Need for Sanctions, Not Symbolic Condemnations
38:36 Drawing Lessons from South Africa's Anti-Apartheid Movement
40:01 Hope in the Streets: Global Grassroots Resistance
41:22 The Manufactured Famine and Urgent Call to Act
43:12 Gaza’s Long Siege: Not New, Just Intensified
45:35 The UN’s Paralysis and U.S. Vetoes Blocking Justice
47:19 Global Responsibility vs. Neutrality in Genocide
49:01 Closing Words: What Listeners Can Do Now
50:00 Final Calls to Action and Resources to Support the Cause
52:00 Conclusion: No More Genocide in Our Name
Rough TRANSCRIPT:
I'm Mimi Rosenberg. And with Ken Nash, bring you Building Bridges. Today, we confront one of the gravest humanitarian and legal crises the world has known. The deliberate starvation of the people of Gaza. As famine conditions deepen, over 127 people, most of them children, have died from hunger. A direct result of Israel's siege and blockade.
Otherwise, 73 people were killed trying to reach aid. Just yesterday. Israel has killed over 1,000 aid seekers in Gaza since May. And just interrupted the Gaza-bound ship, the Handala, carrying activists and humanitarian goods, carrying our labor, comrade Chris Smalls,
trying to deliver aid, violently interrupted the boat in international waters. Now this, this genocide, this famine, this starvation, it's not a natural disaster. It's a man-made catastrophe. And according to leading human rights organizations, a war crime. Dawn, Democracy for the Arab World Now, has documented how the United States,
despite its own legal obligations, continues to provide military and diplomatic support to Israel, implicating U. S. officials in aiding and abetting war crimes. As to the spectacle of parachutes dropping aid, the Gaza Strip does not need flying acrobatics. It needs an open humanitarian corridor and a steady daily flow of aid trucks to save what remains of the lives of the besieged,
starving people, the children. Today we ask, what must we do to get the world to enforce international law and protect the people of Gaza? We're honored now to welcome two powerful voices in the movement for justice and human rights in the Middle East. Joining us now is Raid Jarrah,
the Advocacy Director at Democracy for the Arab World Now, better known as DAWN. Raid is a seasoned Arab-American political advocate based in Washington with a long track record of challenging U. S. foreign policy in the Middle East. At dawn, Raid is at the forefront of efforts to hold both regional and international actors
accountable for human rights violations. The ongoing crisis in Gaza. Zaid Abbas Samrouj is the executive director of the Middle East Children's Alliance, a Palestinian refugee from Daisha camp and a filmmaker, a journalist and educator. His work has centered on amplifying the voices of Palestinian children and communities through cultural and humanitarian initiatives.
Together, they bring deep insight into the ongoing crisis in Gaza and the broader struggle for Palestinian rights. Zaid, you've been in close contact with communities in Gaza and the people working tirelessly to support them. Can you give us a first-hand account? of the devastating conditions on the ground,
what families, especially children, are enduring right now, and what is happening as well to the humanitarian workers and organizations trying to deliver aid. How are they being targeted, obstructed, or silenced? And thank both of you for joining us. Saeed?
Thank you. Thank you for having me, and hello, Riot, and all the listeners. Yeah, the last, actually, contact was today with my colleagues, and we have our staff members. They are working on the ground in GizaSrib, in different parts of GizaSrib, actually. And we get on the time, the updates, and try to check with each other what can we do. So far, still, it's a huge catastrophe for the people inside Gaza Strip, all over Gaza Strip. And children, they are facing death as they are facing the desired massive starvation by the
Islamic occupation. where many reports coming and they update us over 40,000 babies below one years old. They are facing death as a result of this mass starvation. These children, they are missing the milk, the needs, the vitamins, Formula One, And of course, the hospitals, they are out of any possibility to support them and to help them. And the number is increasing. And as you mentioned, actually,
it's for the people that are already killed by this design mass of starvation, 147, among them 88 children. This is the last statistics came today from the Palestinian sources there in the ground and from our staff there in the ground. Families, they wake up if they sleep. They wake up since morning and try to find any kind of possibility to have food or water. And even if they leave their houses, maybe there will not be a possibility to return back.
And most of the people, just to remind the people that are living in displaced refugee camps, they leave their tents, looking everywhere. People walking. . . miles try to get food and try to find a way where they can get food and it's it's
the it's devastating for everyone living inside because as my colleagues describe it everyone facing death even some of our staff they are living in this in the areas where they are in the usual days like i can say a few weeks ago Our kitchen, they used to distribute hot meals to the people living in the displaced refugee camps. Right now, our staff, like everyone in Gaza, they are starving. They are looking for food.
They are trying to help themselves and help the people around them. And the situation, Gaza, as we hear all over the news, like right now, that day by day, the number can be doubled, tripled of the people.
They are dying as a result of that. At the same time, you have the people, they are killed. Israel never stopped bombing and shilling everywhere. In the displaced refugee camps, in the tents, families erased still. until today, and 92 people, according to the report, they are already killed today by the Israeli Bombard Gardens.
And of course, among them, 41, they were killed while they are around the food distribution areas where the Israelis control and they are shooting at them, and they killed 41 among them. This is the situation right now. Of course,
it's everyone focused about the starvation and about the hunger is hitting everywhere in Gaza. At the same time, the water issue is another big crisis inside Gaza Strip. We are speaking in summer. Summer in Gaza, end of July, it's very hot. People out of drinking water, they don't have enough clean water. Even organizations like us, we're still working in this field. We're still distributing water in different parts of Gaza Strip, but we are doing nothing.
It's not enough for anything. People, they need water inside Gaza. And the death is surrounding everyone in Gaza. Wherever you turn your face, there are people facing death. Even if you go to the hospital, death is there because doctors, they say they don't have a fuel to operate. For example,
the kidney, the dialysis department, they are out of services in different hospitals right now in Gaza still. And as I say, like even hospitals not safe for the people, wherever they are in their tents and they are around food distribution centers and they are in the streets. And you hear from our colleagues,
which they witnessed many times that people collapsing while they are walking. And because some of them, they were not able to eat for a few days. Some people, they are surviving, to be honest with you, around salt and water. This is what hunger strikers usually, prisoners, they do that. When they are announced to start a hunger strike inside the prison, the only thing they use every day, they don't eat food at all. The only thing is some salt and water just to keep your body function as much as they can.
But people in Gaza. . . is not able to even to access any kind of food right now. And the salt, it's the only solution for them. This is the situation on all over Gaza Strip. And even today, like I need to mention it,
even the Israeli human rights organizations coming after 22 months, they'd sell them. The human rights organization called Bait Salem and Physicians for Human Rights, they came to announce what's going on. It's genocide and that Israel, what they are doing right now against the regime inside Gaza Strip, it's a genocide. Now the world, they are jumping in the news.
Sorry, I want to jump somewhere. Like they're speaking about helping the people in Gaza, they should allow the food. But the world, the international community, all this Western government right now, where they want to send their airplanes to drop food, which is not a solution. Aero drop is not a solution for the people in Gaza.
The only solution there is to open the borders to allow food. the relief organization, every organization work inside Gaza Strip, including ourselves, United Nations, World Food Programme, the World Center Kitchen, and many other organizations to do the work.
Because a few months ago, this is what we used to do, try to help the people. We were not doing enough since October 7th until now. We are not doing enough for the people in Gaza, but at least we were doing some work. You speak about thousands of trucks, They are not far from these children. These babies, they are dying. Thousands of trucks, only a few miles from them. And these babies, they are facing the death.
This is the reality in Gaza. And day by day, hour by hour, the number of the people, they are dying as a result of this design. Mass starvation by the Israeli occupation and their allies, their supporters, it's hitting bad and threatening the lives of the people inside Gaza,
especially children. You know, one of the statistics or facts that I had received from a contact in Gaza was that one of the little girls that had died actually, and it just stuck with me, one of the children died. When she died, she weighed less than when she was actually born a year before that. And the other thing that is not being mentioned is,
regardless if the aid comes through, that the malnutrition has so affected the totality of the body of children and others, but children, so that their bodily functions, whether it is physical deformities or intellectual limitations from the malnutrition, are permanently stamped into their essence,
into their lives at this juncture, so that the crime against humanity is so broad Raeed, your thoughts on this, and I'm still both incensed at the fact that the Egyptians, amongst others, because I know part of your thoughts are we have to appeal to the world. But you look at the Egyptians,
they still won't and haven't opened the Rafah crossing and insisted, along with the other Arab countries, to bring aid in. Zaid, your thoughts about where we are at this point? Thanks for having me on the show again, Mimi. Thank you for your contribution. It's very important. And sending you and all.
. . the Palestinian-American listeners, you know, lots of love and support while we go through this collective trauma. Mimi, what's going on in Palestine is unbelievable. It's very difficult to describe in words. And we feel tired.
You know, we feel tired describing our experiences to people. everyone outside of Palestine, especially describing what's going on to audiences in the United States. Because as Palestinian American, I feel torn that my tax dollars as a U. S. citizen are going to support and fund the genocide machine that is killing my people in Gaza,
that is continuing the genocide that is unfolding for our eyes every day. It's also continuing the apartheid and occupation in the rest of historic Palestine. It's very difficult times for us to continue to advocate for our humanity, while Palestinian children continue to be starved to death, with the U. S. government supporting those policies full on. 21 months into the genocide, The Trump administration continues the legacy of the US government by its
unconditional support for Israeli crimes, making the US not only a partner in crime, not only Guilty of aiding and abetting an ongoing genocide. But honestly, the US at this point is committing genocide directly. If you see what President Trump was saying in the last couple of days, calling for the erasure of Gaza, the complete destruction of.
. . It's unbelievable to hear a U. S. president say this while billions of U. S. dollars continue to pump Israeli crimes there and make them possible. So to answer your question,
Mimi, I would say what we really want at this point is for the world to step in and stop both Israel and the United States. You know, we're not calling on the U. S. government. to investigate itself no more. We're not calling on Israel to stop being cruel.
We're not calling on Israeli leaders to stop being genocidal maniacs. We're calling on the world to step in and stop this genocide now. We're calling on the United Nations General Assembly to vote for a peacekeeping force that would protect Palestinians, to kick Israel out of the UN General Assembly, and to impose sanctions on Israel and any other country, including the United States, that is supporting Israeli crimes.
These are things that are honestly no-brainers. I can't believe that 21 or 22 months into the genocide, we're still calling for the most basic human reactions for what would help Palestinians. The time for. . . Symbolic gestures and, you know, symbolic statements coming from world leaders is far gone.
Like this is not, there is no time anymore for symbolic gestures. It is time for action. So I want to emphasize, you know, Don's call. for the UN General Assembly to do what it did back in 1956 under the Uniting for Peace process, where it allows the General Assembly to step in when the UN Security Council is unable to do anything. And back in 1956,
the General Assembly did send peacekeeping forces to Egypt, and we're calling on them to convene and send peacekeeping forces to Gaza now, immediately, this week. There is no reason to wait any longer. to impose sanctions on Israel now and here, this week, there is no reason to wait. There is no reason to wait for an arms embargo against Israel and any country that facilitates the genocide.
These things should happen in the here and now. And we're also calling on the UN to declare what's going on in Gaza as a famine. It's unbelievable that we're seeing all of this. . . man-made disaster with Palestinian babies dying, children starving to death, while the UN is telling us that they can't go to a declaration of a famine because
of some technical obstacles, you know, data collection from inside of Gaza, not meeting the. . . the IPC standards for how many people are dying per day. How would we know how many people are dying per day?
Israel is preventing us from doing any of this. So I think the UN is doing a lot, and the UN is a part of the solution, whether it's UNRWA, whether it is WHO, whether it's FAO, other organizations. that have been helping and supporting Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank,
they are a part of the solution. But we are calling on the UN to step up and do more. Do more when it comes to the declaration of famine. Do more in holding and convening the UN General Assembly to actually send peacekeeping forces to protect Palestinians in the here and now. And we're going to continue with that in a moment. But I'd like to ask Ziad, you know, you've described harrowing conditions.
We know that humanitarian organizations like yours are not just delivering aid, they're also bearing witness. So part of what I want to ask you is, how do you account for or how do we direct ourselves or should we even bother really to direct ourselves to the end? the outrageous slings and arrows of the Israeli government and the media from the BBC to all the media in the US and so on that continues to give these shoddy, outrageous myths that they do to enable them to
continue to perpetrate genocide from Hamas steals food, and that's the issue, to there is not a famine, there is not starvation, there is enough, and on and on. I mean, politically, what are your thoughts and I don't know how anyone contains one's anger, or should they?
But your thoughts on whether we need to debunk the mythologies or what it is that we truly need to say about the Israeli government and its partner, as Raid was saying, its partner in genocide, the U. S. ? ?
And no need for either one of you to mute yourselves. Sorry, yes. Actually, this is something like it's very clear, become very clear for the world, become very clear for almost every government in the world. Rad spoke about United Nations, about United States. By the way, when you speak about this genocide, we are speaking about 2025.
All the other genocides are not going with the history. That coming to this level, like we are witnessing a reality show called Genocide in Gaza Strip, while the whole world is watching. And I say the whole world, they are watching the criminals. And here I'm not speaking like about just Israel is responsible about this genocide. All the countries, they are supporting Israel, funding Israel, giving weapons to Israel. They are participating in this genocide.
All the countries and the governments, they are silent and not doing any kind of intervention to stop this genocide. They are participating in it. And all the people, they are ignoring what's going on in Gaza, and they try to live their lives in the way how they, like, deny that what's going on in Gaza,
it's a genocide. We are responsible. There is no place right now. There is no neutral place. This is genocide. You stand against this genocide. You stand in solidarity with the people of Palestine. Or you are, with your silence, or you support the genocide.
This is the fact. Now, as Raid said in the beginning, no words we can describe what's going on. But for us, everything has become very clear. And when you speak about the media, the media is part of the genocide. I can see recently, after 22 months. . . Right now, you can see some reports show up in the mass media in the United States.
They start speaking about Gaza and genocide and the questioning because it's the power dynamic and the debate between the two major parties to blame the government. But in fact, they are participating. They were never considered that. Even considered that they were a genocide in Gaza. Well, it's a long time ago. The genocide started a long time ago, in October 2023. At the same time, right now, today, you can read many articles.
I'm not promoting the New York Times. All these kind of mass media right now, they start covering because they try to catch up. Because in the beginning, they were part of the. . . shut down the Palestinian narrative, not listening to the Palestinian voice, not listening even to the human rights organization,
international human rights, even to the United Nations, even the way how the United Nations was attacked by Israel, the United States, and illuminating. Right now they are not doing bad services in the ground. Everything has become very clear. We are witnessing that.
I am a Palestinian. I'm living here. I feel I'm privileged. I still have water. But witnessing that, it's something like, it's unbelievable. But it's not about us as a Palestinian. It's not about me. It's not about Raid.
It's not about the Palestinians living in the diaspora, even in the United States here. It's about the people of Palestine, inside Palestine. And it's not just about the people in Gaza Strip. Because some action of the genocide, it's moods. It's can be based from Gaza Strip to West Bank, how the settlers, they are attacking the Blassey and West Bank. And how even today, like they were a teacher.
He was killed today. Which was under a huge attack by the settlers since years right now. Today he was shot and killed by the city laws. Even after they shot him, the Israeli bulldozers moved over his body and he died. He's a teacher of 21 years. So the genocide taking certain kind of. . .
A direct way in Gaza Strip and whispered back, it's happening for a while right now by the Israeli settlers attacking, and these settlers protecting by the Israeli army, by the Israeli police, by the Israeli soldiers. Now, this is what's going on about Israel. This is a new fascist system. It's very clear in every action they are doing.
Even the Israeli, as I said, some of the Israeli thinkers, including some of the Israeli journalists, they start to speak about this in a very clear way. The Israeli government and unfortunately most of the Israeli community, they are supporting what's going on in Gaza because they are not taking their stand.
to stop what's going on inside Gaza Strip. This is what's happening in Gaza. It's a lesson for the history. I don't know how the history will carry it, but this is something it will bring a lot to this world. And I can say sometimes, and I want to be clear here, sometimes Like people, because like they think they have the right to do,
to protect themselves using all these kinds of lies to protect themselves. But actually what's going on, this is a new kind of fascism coming. When the victim become a victimizer, they know how to hurt. And this is what's happening with many of the Israeli government. They speak about it in a very clear way. They are not hiding it. We are not talking about something secret. They make official announcement inside the Israeli government and they come and
speak about ethnic cleansing, taking over Gaza, taking over Bustang, annexation of Bustang, killing the Balassian people, killing the Balassian children. They speak about it. It's not something like we are.
. . They are hiding it. They speak about it in a very clear way. But it's very clear. United States government, they are protecting Israel in every level. He spoke about the role of the United Nations, the Security Council, the General Assembly. United States, how many times they used the veto?
I can say, I don't have the accurate number, maybe over 130 times in the history, a veto to block any kind of resolution, at least condemned what Israel is doing for the Palestinians. Part of the solution is here. It's our responsibility as American people. The history and the world in the future will hold us accountable for what's
happening right now in Gaza and what's happening in all Palestine. And what I can say, the people, what they need to do, it's only one thing, to take an action, to continue. We don't have a choice.
And this is what my colleague in Gaza Strip and all the people in Gaza Strip, all the time they say, the only hope we have right now to stop what's happening to the people in Gaza, to illuminate a generation according to the UNICEF, A generation in Gaza Strip facing death right now to stop this kind of ethnic cleansing and genocide. The only hope for them is the people in the street to take an action, to build a movement and to move on.
I know the time is ticking and I agree totally with the riot. There is no time to start thinking. Even today I was reading some government, Western government, Germany, England, they want to air drop. What?
This is not the solution. You are already giving weapons to Israel. If you want to help the people in Gaza, stop funding Israel, stop giving weapons to Gaza. At the same time, allow the relief organization to do their work and to get the food inside Gaza. So the only hope for the people in Gaza according, and here I am quoting them. The only hope for them is that we will continue doing actions, whatever is possible,
to stop this genocide. And you're listening to Building Bridges. I'm Mimi Rosenberg. We're diving into the deepening humanitarian catastrophe in Gaza, where starvation is being used as a weapon of war. And joining us are two powerful advocates, Raeed Girard from Democracy for the Arab World Now, Dawn.
and Ziad Abbas Samrush of the Middle East Children's Alliance Mecca. And they are bringing us legal insight, lived experience, and frontline knowledge of what's happening and what must be done to stop it. And with that, Rayud, I want to go back to you and your thoughts about the UN and the issue of sanctions. Certainly,
we agree, people in the street and upping the ante and the incredible perseverance and activity of the students, which has brought to world attention the plight of Gaza. But your thoughts on what Zaid was saying, which is that the limitations to the UN because of the power of the US in the General Assembly. So how are we to look at and how are we to motivate and activate the UN to do
anything in this crisis with the power of the U. S. in the General Assembly. Listen, the US has very limited power in the General Assembly. The US has lots and lots and lots of power in the Security Council because the US, like the other permanent members, there are five permanent members of the Security Council with veto powers.
And any of them can just make the whole system dysfunctional by continuing to veto every decision. The US has been doing this for the past couple of years. The US has very, very limited power with the UN General Assembly. They can bully a few small countries here and there and threaten them with cutting U. S. aid or assistance or something.
But the U. S. has had very limited power at the UN General Assembly. And we have seen in the past few years, the General Assembly has actually worked in a much more efficient way because it's more democratic and no countries have veto powers there. Now, of course,
the obstacle is if the General Assembly were to hold another emergency session under the Uniting for Peace process, they will need a two-state majority of the General Assembly before approving a peacekeeping force. It's not impossible. It's actually very doable. It's not easy, but it is not impossible. And I think that is something we should be asking the General Assembly to do.
And I think that is something that big, you know, powerful countries and organizers at the UN General Assemblies are able to pull off if there was enough coordination. I mean, I think the other thing is. . .
And you're also talking about the deployment of an international protection force to safeguard Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank from future aggression. Yeah. That's right. And we actually included both of these recommendations today to the ongoing conference that's going on as we speak at the UN. There is a conference to discuss the peaceful question of the peaceful settlement of the question of Palestine.
And it's co-led by France and a few other countries from the region. It's attended by over 100 countries. And we send them recommendations today saying that they should invoke Uniting for Peace emergency session at the UN General Assembly and then ask for peacekeeping forces in Gaza and peacekeeping forces in the West Bank because Palestinians in the West Bank and in Gaza need protections immediately. I think the other ask that we have, Mimi, are much easier.
Asking countries to sanction Israel or kick Israel out of the United Nations General Assembly or impose an arms embargo. These are things that are proven to be very powerful. Like we saw how the end of the apartheid regime in South Africa. . . happened because of these international actions and solidarity with South Africans who were fighting from within.
And at the time, I want to remind you and listeners that at the time, the two most powerful countries that supported the apartheid regime in South Africa, were the United States and Israel, and they bullied everyone and they threatened everyone, and they continue to support the regime in South Africa until its last days. So it's doable, even with U.
S. support, even with Israel's support, that the world could and should step up its organizing to do this. I mean, I do think that a lot of what we're doing is working, Mimi. And I know many people are feeling despair because it's been almost two years of protesting and screaming and doing everything possible without seeing immediate results.
But I want everyone to know that whatever we're doing is working. The Trump administration is feeling the pressure. The Israeli government is feeling the pressure. They're going through all the extent to lie and have. . . PR campaigns, like you were mentioning,
Mimi, they're saying, oh, Palestinians are stealing the food. Hamas is stealing the food. Everyone is laughing at them now. But, you know, they're making up all of these fake excuses because they're under pressure. They're showing the world airdrops where Israeli airplanes drop like a few packages
of food or allow a few trucks going in because they're feeling the pressure, because the international pressure is brewing. Because the entire world is pushing and pushing and pushing. So whatever we have been doing is working. And I want everyone on this call and everyone who's listening to us to know that they have to continue to do the same. Whether it is calling on our government, whether it is. .
. you know, pressuring other international entities and governments to step up and do the right thing, whether it is protesting in the streets, whether it's talking to our families, all of these things are making a difference, small incremental difference that will help us get to a point to stop the ongoing
genocide. And I want you to elaborate, and Zaid, please enter this discussion if you have any questions or thoughts about any of the things I was saying, please, so elaborate. One of the things that I was interested in is what Dawn was calling a Gaza
scorecard, which outlines 16 U. S. demands that Israel has failed to meet. So could you highlight the most critical of these unmet demands and their consequences on the ground? Or is it just all flim-flam and hypocrisy in any event that the U. S.
has made any demands? It certainly speaks with the forked tongue, as we would say. I mean, I can't comment, but I like to hear Ziyad's comments as well. Sure. So would I. No, go ahead, Ryan. I gave it to you. I will jump in.
Go ahead. I mean, listen, I think the U. S. administration under Biden was definitely. . . A part of the genocide machine. earlier this year,
asking the ICC to arrest, to issue arrest warrants against President Biden and top officials in his administration for aiding and abetting genocide. We made a very strong legal case that President Biden and his top officials are war criminals who should be arrested and arrested. prosecuted as war criminals because of their support of Israel's genocide. And the same case could be made, and even a bigger case could be made against this administration.
This administration is not only involved in aiding and abetting genocide by sending weapons and facilitating politically what Israel has been doing. The Trump administration is also involved in obstruction of justice. They have been threatening the ICC other mechanisms of justice around the world. And the mere obstruction of justice is a crime under the Rome statute, and that by itself could get them in trouble. On top of that,
as I said earlier in this show, Mimi, the rhetoric coming from President Trump and some of his assistants in the past few weeks actually crosses the line from just assisting a genocide to committing genocide. The language that he used this week when he said, you know, Gaza should be cleaned out and Palestinians should be thrown out of Gaza and all of these things that he has been saying over the last few months.
These are genocidal acts, genocidal intent, genocidal rhetoric funded and aided fully by the United States. So the US government is not a part of the solution whatsoever. The US government at this point has Palestinian blood on its hands. They are killing Palestinian babies with their policies and their weapons. And they're continuing of the only government that is continuing to support Israel at this point.
So so my answer to you is that I am not expecting the U. S. government to step in and save the day here. They're not they're not our saviors. And Trump is not our savior. Trump is as much of a criminal as Netanyahu. And they should both be held accountable from our perspective today. As a human rights organization, from my perspective as a U.
S. citizen and taxpayer, my call here is to pressure our government to say stop, but also to tell other governments around the world, help us stop our government. It's unstoppable. We have used every venue in this country. And that might mean sanctions.
What kind of sanctions do you think could be utilized? And then please, Ziad, enter this discussion as well. The lowest hanging fruit to stop the U. S. intervention is to at least stop the flow, the. . . The supply chain of U.
S. weapons that are being sent to Israel. And I'll give you a couple of options, a couple of examples. The easiest one to discuss is, for example, the U. S. caterpillar bulldozers that have been sent to Israel over the years. And now these bulldozers are being used for ethnic cleansing, for destruction of homes in the West Bank and in Gaza.
The D9 Caterpillar bulldozer. Some of these bulldozers are made in part in Mexico and Canada. We have been calling on Canada and Mexico to stop supplying the U. S. with their chain of supply for the bulldozers. We're calling on European countries to stop supplying their part of the chain of supply for the F-35s. Whether it's a small screw in the wing, whether it is a small part of the helmet, stop it.
And that will stop the flow of arms to Israel. So we're not talking about a full-fledged boycott campaign for the United States yet. But we're asking for at least symbolic disruption of supply. Of course, when it comes to Israel, there is a standing call for sanctions against Israel similar to the sanctions that were imposed on the apartheid regime in South Africa. It's our comprehensive economic system.
sanctions, no trade with Israel, no relationships with Israel, until it stops the genocide and apartheid against the Palestinian people. Yeah, I think I don't have that much to add to that. But yeah, for us, as the example,
we can see when it comes to this level, it's what happened in South Africa. And actually, the South African, they are very clear, even going to the international courts and try to hold Israel accountable. And we saw Nicaragua try to hold Germany accountable for their support for the genocide in Palestine,
et cetera. This is the only thing like I can say that when you speak about sanctions and take the example of South Africa, which I believe what Israel is committing something like is by learning what the apartheid system did in South Africa. We are coming in 2025. This is like double down. To hold Israel accountable for that.
And the United States. And some Western Europe governments where they are supporting Israel and defending and justifying for what Israel is doing at the same time. This is politically where it's coming with the government. But I hope, with all the respect to your radio, I believe the people that are listening for us. This is the most important part for us. We want these people. I'm still optimistic,
even the people in Gaza, in a way or another, under this, what we are facing, they're still optimistic that because they have big hope in people. The solidarity movement, we can see how much it's expanded the last 22 months. I see that in even high schools, and I see that in universities. I see that as Mecca.
Through the base we have, how our base, it's doubled. We receive support coming from different countries in the world, not just in the United States. And you receive it sometime in $5, but the $5 means a lot. But what I want to say, the hope is the people themselves. The people, they need to double their actions right now. Because the way how this mass starvation is designed, And when I say design, that Israel organized it,
planned everything, and they got the green light from their own allies and supporters to do what they are doing right now, that the people, they need to act fast and quickly and double what they are doing as actions. And I hope, I'm hoping, like even the United Nations,
the General Assembly, to jump in, to do something, to take over. We saw many other issues happening with the genocide, like in Rwanda, for example, in Yugoslavia,
and how the international community acted and did an intervention to stop that. We are hoping. But as Raid mentioned in the beginning, that until now they didn't declare this is a famine happening in Gaza. And this is where the power dynamic and the blackmailing of the international organization happened by the United States. In any case, for us right now, it's the most urgent thing. It's coming to the.
. . to any human being inside Gaza Strip, to any child, to any woman. Like today, I was listening to my colleague. They were speaking again and again about moms. They have babies, and they are not able to produce milk for their babies. And they are witnessing their children dying in front of them because they are hospital. I think I believe the most important right now is the actions in every level.
And I totally agree with Raid about United Nations and General Assembly. They need to push and do something. And not to accept the blackmail. I know when you think about the countries made, the members of the General Assembly, many of these countries actually, moving by remote controls by United States of America or Western countries in general.
And this is where the time they need to jump in. We counted that and we needed this time. But right now, the most urgent thing for us is to stop this unicide and to allow the medicine and the food to get inside Gaza to help the people survive. Do you think, say, that enough has been done to help us really understand that this is what is
occurring now is not an aberration, but the continuation really of a deliberate project of colonial expansion, of racial domination and cultural erasure underpinned by a foundation of legal impunity and ideological fabrication? Have we done enough? Is that part of what has to happen so that people don't see this as incidental or inadvertent? Your thoughts on that, Zahid and Raid? Yeah, for me, I'm a senior refugee.
My family already uprooted in 1948. And since I was born and grew up in a refugee camp, and all my life, even my body from the food from United Nations, up till I was like 14, 15 and we survived the Nakba and survival phase like our parents. I was born in 1964 and we survived what we call survival phase for the people after the Nakba and we moved to the creativity. Right now,
for us as Palestinians, I'm not going with the intellectual level to speak about the nature of the Zionist colonial system and their plans. And they are very clear about their plans. You are not surprised what they are doing. This is what they tried to do since 1948, and they continue. It's an ongoing genocide. They slow up and move faster sometimes.
And the demographic issue, it's still a problem for the Israelis. Now they acknowledge and they see that the number of the Palestinians living on the historic Palestine is bigger than the number of the Jewish people. Without the Palestinians, they are living in the diaspora and in the exile around Palestine and all over the world. And by what they are doing in Gaza, it's serve their own plans. At the same time, I'm not speaking about just what they call it radical government in Israel.
Every government in Israel, it was radical government. We never experienced, even during Oslo agreement, Zhak Rabin, he's the one who was assassinated by the Israelis. He's the one actually, he was behind the breaking bones policy in the first intifada and how the Palestinians were tortured.
And this is my generation, we experienced that. Etc. Every government in Israel is part of this. It's not just something we can blame now the recent government about what's going on. It's the history of Zionist movement, how they are. Looking at the Palestinians, dehumanize the Palestinians. And of course, it reminds me of my mom in the bus. My mom, she never went to the university.
She used to say that Jewish people, when they came and migrated to Palestine, they didn't come to live with us. They came to replace us. And this is the fact. And this is why some of the Zionist settlers like plans about how building settlements in Gaza Strip right now. Even they were the draw from Gaza in 2005,
what we call it with a draw, but actually they are controlling Gaza. And don't forget the listeners, just I want to remind them that Israel under siege, blockade for 18 years right now. The last two years, it came in a different way with ongoing genocide, actually,
against the Palestinian. So the nature of the Israeli occupation, the nature of this colonial system, it's become very clear. And this colonial system is funded and supported by the Western countries, especially the United States and, of course, Europe.
And for us, it's very clear. And when I say we are very optimistic that the Palestinians, they say that, like, after right now 77 years, for since the NACDA and even almost we are getting close like right now to 100 we are like right now 100 years after Belfort Declaration in 1917 over 100 like 10 years almost
And still, Palestinians never gave up their struggle, never gave up their struggle for their freedom and for their liberation. Now, it's up to the world. It's a level where we see the Palestinian people, they are. . . targeted just because you are a Palestinian.
Even me and Raid and many other listeners may be Palestinian. It's enough to be a Palestinian to be a target for the Israelis or for the Zainist movement. I say for the Israelis, like if you are living in Palestine and for the Zainist movement, wherever you are living. in the United States. And we saw how the Zionists all debublished and tried to feed the American government targeting Palestinians.
We see that in Europe and many other countries where the Zionists target the Palestinians. So the moment you introduce yourself As a Palestinian, every Israeli, I can say, they feel you a threat, even when you don't open your mouth. You don't say anything.
Just you say, I'm a Palestinian. They feel you are a threat, and they need to stop this kind of thing. So let me just ask you, no, not at all, not at all. We should have much, much more time, and we will continue to pursue this every program that I have and every hour for every program. I just would like in really a minute for each of you,
and I'm so sorry that we don't have more, but I do want to know your final thought, Zaid, and Raheem. What is to be done? What do you tell our listeners at this juncture to do to support the work that both of you are doing? And we have just about literally a minute for each of you.
Zaid, why don't you take us there and then Raid, your thoughts since you have some particular issues that you'd like to raise with us to support. I would like to ask the people, the listeners, to continue to do the actions they are doing. I'm sure wherever they are right now, there are organizers, there are groups,
they have their own plans. And to support the Palestinians and to stand in solidarity with Palestine in every way that is possible. I leave the rest of the time for a ride. I spoke more than ever in this. Go ahead, ride. Thank you for everything that you said, and thank you for all of your work. I would say, Mimi, two quick things that I would suggest for your listeners.
The first one is to follow my organization on social media. It's DAWN, D-A-W-N, and we are on all different platforms. Social media, we have updates, daily updates. You can go to our website. It's D-A-W-N Don Mina, M-E-N-A, as in Middle East and North Africa, dot org. And sign up for our newsletter. We send it weekly with lots and lots and lots of information. I also want to invite everyone to sign our petition to the UN General Assembly to take action.
You can find it on Bitly Peace Force Now. So it's a shortcut, Bitly Peace Force Now. And we must say that the resistance movement is demanding a humanitarian corridor to allow aid trucks to enter Gaza now, now to alleviate the Israeli-created famine. And as we close today's program, we're left with the stark truth. The starvation of Gaza's people is not a failure of logistics. It is a failure of humanity and law.
Dawn's findings make clear that this is a deliberate act, enabled by powerful nations and shielded by silence. But silence is complicity. The United States must be held accountable for its role, and the international community must act. not with words, but with enforcement of the laws meant to protect civilians. And we urge our listeners to stay informed, speak out,
and demand that our leaders, in quotes, uphold the principles of justice because in the face of atrocity, neutrality is not an option. You've been listening to Building Bridges podcast. I'm Mimi Rosenberg. Today's conversation with Raeed Girard of Dawn and Zahid Abbas Samrush of the Middle East Children's Alliance has laid bare a devastating truth.
What's happening in Gaza is not a war. It's an extermination plan, a deliberate state-engineered famine. This is not just a humanitarian crisis. It's another Nakba unfolding in real time. And we can and we must do something.
No more genocide in our name. Saeed, Raeed, thank you so much for what you do. And for us, please stay strong.
Thanks for listening. Thank you for having us. Thank you for having us. Absolutely. And we'll continue to build bridges.
I'm Mimi Rosenberg. Hey, this is Michael, a BAI buddy from Brooklyn. WBAI. Oh, WBAI. You're listening to WBAI. 99. 5 FM WBA.
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